Pro1914's Mapping Thread

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
So before I begin, there are a few people who I'd like to thank.

First I'd like to thank Doggo Doggo and Owain6521 Owain6521 for helping me come up with good ideas for improving my map. They've both been huge helpers.

Secondly, I'd like to thank DiBen DiBen for sharing his map and its progress with us. It's been pretty inspiring to watch.

And lastly, I'd like to thank all of you for your contributions to your PBS station from viewers like you.

Thank you!

SO NOW FOR THE MOMENT YOU'VE ALL BEEN WAITING FOR...
I PRESENT TO YOU
rp_c17_d2


c17.png

Now I must admit that the map is nowhere near 100% complete, more like 65%, but I have the basic shape down and would love to get some suggestions.

So heres a list of whats done:
CCH-A
CCH-B
Ration Distribution Center
A few stores
CA Offices
Train Station
Storm System

And what is in development/planned:
Nexus
Abandoned Factory
Another Courtyard with shops
Communal Apartments
Alley System
Underground Water System
Adv. RDC

If you are interested in downloading and playing with the map, I shall provide thee with a link to it.

To Install, just go to SteamLibrary\steamapps\common\GarrysMod\garrysmod then drag both the "Maps" and "Materials" into it.

Please, and I honestly mean this, please provide me some suggestions and tips on what you like and don't.
And thanks again for taking an interest in my pride and joy. Honestly means the world to me.​
 
Last edited:

Bi-Em

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2019
237
First off [ Insert " Nice " meme ] and second I do have suggestion what you could add to the map .

Ya could put in a abandone rebel outpost somewhere in sewers which will be primaly spot for Xen species [ Zombies , Headcrabs ]
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
Now that it's morning and I'm awake, I'd like to share some of my progress, along with some neat features my map includes.

To start off here are some pictures of when I began vs where I am now.

Before:
ohQQmbD.jpg
After:
20200209133713_1.jpg

Before:
uSdt441.jpg

After:
20200209133700_1.jpg

Before:
20180313230818_1.jpg

After:
20200209133432_1.jpg

And then here are just some other screenies.
20200209133600_1.jpg 20200209133611_1.jpg


20200209133617_1.jpg
 

Cacti

Legend
Mar 31, 2015
606
Excellent work so far, I look forward to seeing your progress.

I have some suggestions:
-Less Hl2 interiors. In some places (T6's nexus comes to mind) they enhance the map, but if you have a lot of them it starts to look like lazy mapping, even if the map is very good.
-I'd remove/replace the interior of the warehouse across the street from the train station and/or put some crappy hovels people can live out of inside it. In its current state I feel like it won't get much use.
-A small apartment shop with an apartment or two above in one of the buildings beside the train station would be good to help spread the RP hubs across the map. You don't want parts of the map to feel useless or too empty.
-Make more ways to get to/into/out of places. Nothing is more frustrating as a resistance character than a map that's just one or two linear pathways (rp_c45 is the best example of what not to do in my mind) . Likewise, if there's no way for people to evade you, it makes RP as a CP a lot worse. These additional paths can be super simple hallways or maintenance tunnels/vents, the more the merrier. Seriously, put in a lot, even if it starts to feel absurd.
-Make all the windows openable or breakable. I'd expand most of them so they're big enough to crouch walk out of. Keeping a few windows of other shapes for aesthetic purposes is fine.
-Give the hospital an interior. Partway in, make it turn into the nexus, or have an entrance through it to the nexus, which you could place right next door. If the only (or best) medical facility on the map is in the old hospital, it'll create some more natural rp between citizens/cps and some conflict could be spurred when they both need to use the limited space.
-Ghetto looking nexus > super fancy looking nexus. Make it look like it's been created out of some old structure (police station? bank?) instead of making some weirdly shaped interior with all blue walls. That said, bigger tends to be better. Leave a few biggish open rooms people can put builds in and add a bunch of areas that will help facilitate better rp: Perhaps... Lobby/restrooms/big holding cell/private cells/isolation cells/interrogation rooms/interrogation observation room/mess hall/rec room/offices/meeting area/barracks/balcony/helipad/firing range + training area... Fuse a bunch of what works well on other map's nexuses together.
-Put a garage somewhere, either attached to the nexus or as its own separate outpost. I like that the map is mostly APC friendly thus far.
-A hidden room/base or two.
-A cozy park/plaza, perhaps with a fountain, art, or statue commemorating victors new or old. They tend to be better RP hubs if they're private/semi-private.
 

Wheatos

HL2 - Admin
Sep 27, 2015
1,524
idk how other people feel about this but when it comes to shops and apartments, I'd avoid map props. there's nothing worse for me than finding a nice spot to do X but you can't because there's a display case in the middle of the floor or a few tables here and there.
 

Cato

Zealot
Jun 3, 2016
619
As far as nexus's and administrative buildings go, keep in mind it's a lot better to do it somewhat similarly as t6 did, in the sense that it was just some re purposed old police station/office building. Giant combine metal doom forts that are mazes are a waste of time and space IMO. Leave enough breathing room inside to do things ofcourse but nothing extravagant. A mixture of combine technology haphazardly meshed in with the old human architecture. Usage of side alleys and little passageways is encouraged but I'd say heavily limit the amount of secret door spaces. For CCH buildings it's best to keep room open ended and haphazard. Think of the beginning of HL2 apartment buildings, it was CCH-C when we were on city17 build210. From what I heard people absolutely loved it as it encouraged interaction with a lacking of closed off door spaces, windows gleaming outside, as if actually part of the world instead of some little enclosed box. There's likely room for both obviously just try and keep that in mind.
 

blooregardo

padre gringo
Jun 20, 2011
7,579
idk how other people feel about this but when it comes to shops and apartments, I'd avoid map props. there's nothing worse for me than finding a nice spot to do X but you can't because there's a display case in the middle of the floor or a few tables here and there.
Better yet, leave them in, but as physics props that can be moved or deleted.
 

Owain6521

XCCR Ration Hoarder
May 30, 2011
1,898
Excellent work so far, I look forward to seeing your progress.

I have some suggestions:
-I'd remove/replace the interior of the warehouse across the street from the train station and/or put some crappy hovels people can live out of inside it. In its current state I feel like it won't get much use.
-Ghetto looking nexus > super fancy looking nexus. Make it look like it's been created out of some old structure (police station? bank?) instead of making some weirdly shaped interior with all blue walls. That said, bigger tends to be better. Leave a few biggish open rooms people can put builds in and add a bunch of areas that will help facilitate better rp: Perhaps... Lobby/restrooms/big holding cell/private cells/isolation cells/interrogation rooms/interrogation observation room/mess hall/rec room/offices/meeting area/barracks/balcony/helipad/firing range + training area... Fuse a bunch of what works well on other map's nexuses together.
-A hidden room/base or two.
i've got some issues with these tbh. i think with the warehouse it might be better to leave the interior structures up to player agency, and let them use the space as they like

as for the nexus, a load of those areas just feel sort of useless and redundant to me. what does an isolation cell or private cell actually contribute to rp except making the player go afk? as for an observation room, why can units not just observe from inside the room and actually engage in rp with the detainee? a rec room feels odd for units who go off-duty, and training areas/helipads/balconies frankly don't get much use at all

also, a pox on hidden bases
they're awful and lead people to hide away from rp with citizens, we've had a ton of CCCs about them over the years
 

Cacti

Legend
Mar 31, 2015
606
i've got some issues with these tbh. i think with the warehouse it might be better to leave the interior structures up to player agency, and let them use the space as they like

as for the nexus, a load of those areas just feel sort of useless and redundant to me. what does an isolation cell or private cell actually contribute to rp except making the player go afk? as for an observation room, why can units not just observe from inside the room and actually engage in rp with the detainee? a rec room feels odd for units who go off-duty, and training areas/helipads/balconies frankly don't get much use at all

also, a pox on hidden bases
they're awful and lead people to hide away from rp with citizens, we've had a ton of CCCs about them over the years
The hl2 ep2 warehouse rip is sucky for player builds, if it was a wide open (or mostly wide open) room it'd be a different story

Plenty of the nexus features I mentioned can be good facilitators of RP, and if integrated right improve the aesthetic of the map. A lot of these things can't be added later via a propping. It's not my map, but done right, these things I like other people will too. Obviously what gets into the map isn't up to me, but it's good food for thought if nothing else.

Too many cooks often spoils the broth. Some interrogations and RP situations are worsened by the presence of certain (or too many) players. Having like 8 cop characters in one interrogation room all going their own style (or even just staring) when someone significant lots of people want to RP with is getting questioned is dumb

I've been part of and witnessed some interesting interactions on the other side of the one way mirror. To give you just one example, they can sprinkle in an additional element of fear of tension for one or both parties, as players expect (but don't know) significant individual(s) could be behind the glass watching their every move

I like 1 on 1 RP. In many situations it's superior to a big group of people. It definitely might be if a mass of resistance characters all get caught doing something illegal. Lets say there's four of them or so. You want to have enough cells you can split them off and have them all interrogated at once by different characters, preferably with enough space between the rooms people aren't metagaming each other through the walls. I'll admit isolation might not get much use, but why not include cool immersive things that improve the set if you can? (I17's iso pods come to mind) Bad, bland maps don't get much playtime. If you're putting a hundred or more hours of work (Hammer is a pain in the ass and it takes a LOT of effort to make a quality map. So kudos to you mappers, truly) into creating a map, you probably don't want to see it be played once and discarded. I imagine you'd want to join the likes of those whose maps have been used multiple times over rotations. (Sym, Rowtree, Statua... good contributions lads)

Hidden bases aren't awful, but people get bothered by the mingy resistance characters they inevitably attract, even if they make up a tiny minority of the people who use the hidden area. This problem is exacerbated by the fact that most TnBers are uninterested of opposed to mentoring these people (me included, often) into better roleplayers or educating them in more detail on our canon/customs so they aren't as annoying, they'd rather just go the easy route of restricting the places so they don't have to deal with running into the undesirables. Most RP is already hidden away from citizens, if citizen RP was more interesting more people would create/pursue it. We have a reputation for being circlejerkers and elitists at this community for a reason: Most people, especially outside the CCA RP privately in secluded areas, often with the same clique, especially during times of low pop. They're hidden away, just not in a hidden 'base'. Part of the reason S2/S3 have been so successful and enjoyable in the past is the more approachable, casual style they offer: People can RP mostly what they want with who they want where they want, and if people who they don't want around show up they can give them the boot or simply move somewhere else. Combine affiliated characters don't give you any movement restrictions there and seldom bother you. Their presence is typically rare enough it's usually a point of great interest when it happens instead of an annoyance. The sad truth is when most CP chars throw themselves into a RP situation they make it less interesting, exciting, or fun that it was previously. Often they just end up putting the writing that was happening on hold for a few minutes and some mediocre, unmemorable interaction pans out before things go back to the way they were.
 

Doggo

Legend
Jul 2, 2015
1,880
None of these things were ever an issue on T6, so I really don't think they're needed. Extravagant Nexuses yield bad flow and take longer to make.
 

Owain6521

XCCR Ration Hoarder
May 30, 2011
1,898
Too many cooks often spoils the broth. Some interrogations and RP situations are worsened by the presence of certain (or too many) players. Having like 8 cop characters in one interrogation room all going their own style (or even just staring) when someone significant lots of people want to RP with is getting questioned is dumb
i feel like there's an easier solution which is 'don't have 8 cops in an interrogation'

As for stuff like 1-on-1 RP being assisted by single cells, I'd say the same can be applied for holding cells. If you take a person out for questioning or off around a corner to do something sketchy after keeping them in a group, it allows you to have that 1-on-1 but also builds tension for the others, or allows them to deal with the consequences of the 1-on-1 once you're back, and so on.

I also feel like encouraging public, shared spaces and limited hidden areas doesn't cut off options for private roleplay, it does just encourage people to actually interact more if the map is laid out in a way that helps them to.
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
So after reading all of your suggestions, comments, and other statements, thank you again btw, I have decided to confirm/deny any speculations or ideas. I have also posted a map of my map below.

Map:
mapofmymap.png

So to begin, I'd like to start off with Cacti's comment.

"-Less Hl2 interiors."

To be quite honest, I am a bit confused by this. Are you referring to the textures or the sections of the map themselves? The whole map was supposed to be the ep1_c17_02b map, but repaired and made RP suitable. In the case of textures, I was planning to leave most of them alone, aside from a few custom textures when I began polishing it. In the case of the map, besides the original map, there are only two current locations ripped from hl2. Those are both of the warehouses. The larger one is going to be completely redone and was primarily put there as a placeholder. As for the second one I am not going to keep it in its original location, but rather move it to a more suitable location, if not outright remove it.

"-I'd remove/replace the interior of the warehouse across the street from the train station and/or put some crappy hovels people can live out of inside it. In its current state I feel like it won't get much use."

And you're absolutely right. Where it's currently located was not intentional. I had to move it to fit the whole warehouse next to it. I am planning on moving it as I stated above. The interior will also be changed. Honestly, I kinda' liked the idea of shelves that were already put in, but if you guys would rather have it be completely empty I can do that too.

"-A small apartment shop with an apartment or two above in one of the buildings beside the train station would be good to help spread the RP hubs across the map. You don't want parts of the map
to feel useless or too empty."


This is a great suggestion, and I am planning to add an alleyway right next to the train station. This alleyway will lead to a plaza, but I can add shops and what have you along the way.

"-Make more ways to get to/into/out of places. Nothing is more frustrating as a resistance character than a map that's just one or two linear pathways (rp_c45 is the best example of w"hat not to do in my mind) ..."

Another great suggestion that I plan to add when I begin polishing the map up. I plan of having two ways into every courtyard, an expansive underground tunnel system with a few vents and grates that allow for access into certain places, and even insides of walls that might be able to fit a single person into it. I also plan on adding a lot of alleyways so that people can better navigate the map as a whole.

"-Make all the windows openable or breakable. I'd expand most of them so they're big enough to crouch walk out of. Keeping a few windows of other shapes for aesthetic purposes is fine."

As of current, I plan to have almost 90% of the windows breakable except for a few which I plan to keep bars on. As much as I like this idea however, I fear that some players may just abuse the windows and break them which leaves the place looking a mess.

"-Give the hospital an interior. Partway in, make it turn into the nexus, or have an entrance through it to the nexus, which you could place right next door. If the only (or best) medical facility on the map is in the old hospital, it'll create some more natural rp between citizens/cps and some conflict could be spurred when they both need to use the limited space."


This is an interesting idea, however, there are a few issues with it. As much as I'd love for some citizen/cp rp, it'd get pretty annoying to have to constantly make your way through the hospital while trying not to interrupt ongoing medical rp. Like for example if someone had just joined and wanted to walk out onto the street, they'd most likely have to make their way through over three sets of double doors and then past any event where doctors are trying to save a patient. I am actually planning the have the nexus across the street in a small abandoned apartment that is being made into a nexus. (Heavy WIP atm). There would then be a sky bridge extending from there to the hospital where the combine can receive their own treatment.

"-Ghetto looking nexus > super fancy looking nexus. Make it look like it's been created out of some old structure (police station? bank?) instead of making some weirdly shaped interior with all blue walls. That said, bigger tends to be better. Leave a few biggish open rooms people can put builds in and add a bunch of areas that will help facilitate better rp: Perhaps... Lobby/restrooms/big holding cell/private cells/isolation cells/interrogation rooms/interrogation observation room/mess hall/rec room/offices/meeting area/barracks/balcony/helipad/firing range + training area... Fuse a bunch of what works well on other map's nexuses together."

More great suggestions! Man, you're on a roll today lol. As it currently stands, I have the nexus planed inside of an old apartment. I do plan on making it bigger, but rather than wider or longer, I'm planning to make it taller. That way it gives the illusion of a lot of space without there actually being that much. The reason that I'm making it small is because I've noticed that a lot of people prefer smaller ones. It promotes rp elsewhere than the nexus. As much as all of the stuff you mentioned is nice, most of it rarely gets used or ends up taking the rp away from the rest of the city. Some of the things you mentioned I do actually plan on adding, such as a barracks, holding cell, and mess hall.

"-Put a garage somewhere, either attached to the nexus or as its own separate outpost. I like that the map is mostly APC friendly thus far."
Already in the works my friend. View the map above for the location if you are curious as to where I plan to put it. Also, thanks for noticing! :)


"-A hidden room/base or two."
This one, I'm not so sure about. I'm sure there are people who enjoy hidden rooms and what have you, but to be completely real, they're a pain for rp, and they make no sense at all. Why would this soda machine open to an entire underground room? And when something bad happens they're a crutch for escaping people. Don't get me wrong, I will add areas where people can hang out in peace, but not so much in a public place like a CCH or something.


"-A cozy park/plaza, perhaps with a fountain, art, or statue commemorating victors new or old. They tend to be better RP hubs if they're private/semi-private. "
I completely agree semi-private rp hubs are always more fun. That's why where CCH-C is going to be, I'm planning of making it be its own little cove almost. Moss, vines, a little fountain of sorts, the whole works, and the whole place will be nicely shadowed by the neighboring buildings so that the sunlight just barely hits the tops of the other buildings to supply minimal lighting. I can't wait to start on it honestly.


Now onto Wheatos.

"..I'd avoid map props. there's nothing worse for me than finding a nice spot to do X but you can't because there's a display case in the middle of the floor or a few tables here and there. "

A couldn't agree more. "If only that stupid table could've just been a bit more to the left..". This is why when I decorated the place, everything is going to be either a prop_dynamic or a prop_physics. This means that everything can be removed with just a simple remover tool or even the physgun.

Next up we have Cato who says,

"As far as nexus's and administrative buildings go .. do it somewhat similarly as t6 did, in the sense that it was just some re purposed old police station/office building. Giant combine metal doom forts that are mazes are a waste of time and space IMO. Usage of side alleys and little passageways is encouraged but I'd say heavily limit the amount of secret door spaces. For CCH buildings it's best to keep room open ended and haphazard..."

The administrative offices are very in the works at the moment as I'm still playing around with the designs. At the moment it sits in an office building with three floors. It's completely empty, but I hope to have cubicles in each of the floors that way more space is used up. As for the nexus, again, no need to worry about huge forts. I don't plan on adding much more than the essentials. And for the secret doors, the same thing, not really planning on having any. Finally, for the CCH buildings, I've got plans to have walls smashed into each other with a removable board in between them. I've gotten many requests for communal apartments. It's just at the moment I haven't really begun doing that yet, and probably won't until I begin polishing.



Please feel free to ask any more questions you may have and I'll gladly answer them.
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
Also, I've been meaning to ask, what are you guys' thoughts on the factory being where it is? Right now it's a broken rip, but I plan to turn it into a grain factory.
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
Well, now I've officially hit a massive roadblock. After going through hl2ep1 and getting top-down screenies so that I can patch them all together, I found that my map's road actually connects to the road with the train station from ep1. So now I have to decide if I'm going to add it or not. I really want to, but it underminds all of my work, and I'm not sure if it'll work in RP so I really need you guys' help deciding if it comes onboard or not.

Heres what I'm talking about.

The first picture is the maps together. The second one is how I believe the roads connect and how I'd map around it.


hlp1.png hlp2.png
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
Good evening ladies and gentlemen, I bring forth an update. This being a complete rework of the office. Below are before and after shots of the office and its interior. I also completely reworked the skybox and greatly optimized the map. So without further aduit, for your viewing pleasure, here is the OFFICE UPDATE!

BEFORE:
20200327191620_1.jpg
AFTER:
20200327185247_1.jpg

BEFORE:
20200327192045_1.jpg
AFTER:
20200327185301_1.jpg

BEFORE:
20200327192257_1.jpg

AFTER:
20200327185327_1.jpg

BEFORE:
20200327192358_1.jpg
AFTER:
20200327185352_1.jpg


EXTRA SCREENIES
20200327185334_1.jpg 20200327185320_1.jpg

Hope you've all enjoyed, and be sure to stay tuned for more updates!
 

Pro1914

Zealot
Feb 16, 2016
379
I bring forth the nexus. Just a few teaser images, the polishing happens after I've got everything all mapped out, but for now I present these screenies for your enjoyment.

20200401013727_1.jpg 20200401013734_1.jpg

20200401013741_1.jpg 20200401013806_1.jpg

20200401013818_1.jpg 20200401013823_1.jpg



Please keep in mind that I'm 100% open to criticism and questions.
 

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